They should bring them ALL back and give them due process as they should have done in the first place. If they are criminal gang members, then by all means deport them to their home countries. As for the claim that he can't force El Salvador to send them back, Trump claims he's going to make Denmark give him Greenland and annex Canada--surely he has the cajones to force El Salvador to send back our prisoners.
Their logic of "just because they don't have a criminal record doesn't mean they aren't criminals, it just means they haven't done anything yet. But they will" is infuriating.
Put fucking Stephen Miller in CECOT! We can rail on about Trump and we should, but Stephen Miller is beneath contempt! This is his baby. May the world turn upside down on his NAZI head!
All this bloviating (about Greenland and Canada) by Bloviator in chief is a distraction to keep our attention away from the sinking stock market. As one insightful blog commentator said, "A big price to pay for the promise of cheaper eggs."
From the song “Hurricane” by Bob Dylan: “Couldn’t help but make me feel ashamed to live in a land -Where justice is a game-Now all the criminals in their coats and ties are free to drink martinis and watch the sunrise…”. DISGUSTING!
So we are sending innocent people to a foreign prison? A prison in a country rife with gangs and its problems? They are sacrificing people's lives for political photo ops? Now they claim they can't get him back? They don't want to get him back. These people in our government are the worst in every way.
yes... and it's working. His base believes these deportations are good, they are getting rid of gangs and criminals. But they also believe muskrat is finding fraud and waste so....
It's a setup just like the one in nazi Germany when one could call authorities and claim a Jew, homosexual, gypsy, etc. was staying nextdoor and one could have his annoying neighbors disappeared. That will be the MO next if this is allowed to stand.
As someone who has been through the US Immigration torture... I mean system.... (which was bad enough without being thrown in jail) I cannot imagine what this poor man is going through right now. Or his family. This is insane! I hope he survives. I hope we can bring him back soon.
My fear is that when these evil people in government say they can’t bring him back what they mean is that the gangs in that prison have already tortured and killed him.
That's what I am afraid of too. One of my step-cousins in Ukraine - a soldier - is a POW in Russian custody, and my heart goes out to the family of this poor man, because it is very likely he is treated worse in that horrid prison than Ukrainian POWs are in Russian custody.
This may be the case that breaks the fever. It seems so clear-cut that if there is any justice left in America, someone at a high level will be held to account. Failing that, I propose we offer to trade trump for Garcia, and throw in vance and musk.
I like your negotiating style. I nominate you for the Head of Immigration Negotiation Agency. You don't need to be vetted, just show up and act like you belong there
Alito and Thomas will be all in for this. Kavanaugh will be, too, most likely. Roberts and Cone Barrett may be sane enough to oppose Trump here. Maybe.
“At my direction, every Department of Justice attorney is required to zealously advocate on behalf of the United States,” AG Bondi wrote in a statement to The Times. “Any attorney who fails to abide by this direction will face consequences”.”
Perhaps AG Bondi should be forced to represent the Department of Justice in this case? Just asking for a friend.
That we are sending anyone to a foreign prison paid for with out tax dollars is horrific. The only reason I can see that they would send people to a foreign prison is because it is easier to just disappear people. And when the prisons are hellholes there won't be any media coverage of US citizens protesting outside the prisons because the prisons are in a foreign country.
Remember We (well GW Bush's government in our name) have done this before after 9/11. The CIA imprisoned and tortured suspected terrorists overseas. They did not always get the right people. It was wrong then and now.
Absolutely it is scare tactics. Now it is to scare immigrants to as they say "self deport" but it will be used against all of us to suppress free speech.
And the DOJ attorney acting for the govt., Erez Reuveni, was promptly suspended by Oberfűhrer Bondi, as was HIS boss, August Flentje, for essentially talking outside of school by admitting the deportation fuckup.
But the "Signalgate" crowd continue in their jobs, without fear of accountability because tRump...what an administration, one FUBAR after another, without cessation.
Thanks for this exposition. Most of us knew it is inevitable that indiscriminate roundups by law enforcement officials with poor oversight and hasty detention without due process leads to injustice. And wreckage of lives, families, communities. The diminishment of our entire society by creating a legal sub-basement.
[Small detail of fact that you might want to correct: the habit-forming food is pupusa. A place that makes them: pupuseria. Like tacos and taquerias.]
Everyone knows we’re paying 6 million to El Salvador for this privilege of jailing perfectly law abiding, non-violent human beings! (Minus about a dozen of them)
I'm worried about what happens when this gets to SCOTUS. Lawyer Elie Mystal says SCOTUS isn't going to want a showdown with Trump wherein he has all the power because he'll flaunt their authority and they'll be rendered toothless (the argument that THIS court probably should be is for another time). Mr. Garcia deserves justice, so his case needs to be brought but we should brace ourselves. Will SCOTUS completely bend the knee or will it lead to a constitutional crisis? Of course, bullies do tend to back down when confronted but this regime is a wild card.
What happens if SCOTUS does bend the knee? That may be a constitutional crisis itself.
I’ve wondered this all along — how will the judicial branch MAKE the executive branch obey the law? I haven’t figured it out yet and apparently neither has the judicial branch.
The court could expose the wrong doing in the most dramatic way possible, thereby compelling the congress to impeach. It's all about the level of outrage that can be inspired by a judicial drama.
If they vote against due process, we are lost. I would be very surprised. Of course Alito and Thomas won't, but they won't have the deciding votes. Interesting (frightening) hours ahead.
Great job of summing this up, Jay. It is a frightening and disgusting move by the government. I’m afraid the government may order Abrego Garcia killed to avoid returning him. I would put nothing past them.
I'll bet this administration will have Mr. Garcia killed and left in that prison and then say "ooops, too late!" before they admit their error and even try to bring him home.
In 2020, Vanessa Guillén, a soldier was murdered and dismembered inside an armory at Ft. Hood (now Cavasos). The Army tried to sweep their responsibility under the rug, but Guillén’s sister was on TV and any media that would have her, keeping this in the news and finally there was a law passed requiring the military to report sexual harassment up the chain of command. Her sister made it happen. I hope that Kilmer’s family can do the same.
As a Holocaust scholar, this entire business of shipping people to El Salvador terrifies me to no end. I do hope and pray those men are still alive because 1. it's easier to kill mass numbers of people if you transport them well away from anyone who might complain, and 2. the only possible way you could NOT return someone from a prison where you sent them -- regardless of where the prison is -- is if they're dead.
They should bring them ALL back and give them due process as they should have done in the first place. If they are criminal gang members, then by all means deport them to their home countries. As for the claim that he can't force El Salvador to send them back, Trump claims he's going to make Denmark give him Greenland and annex Canada--surely he has the cajones to force El Salvador to send back our prisoners.
100%
Their logic of "just because they don't have a criminal record doesn't mean they aren't criminals, it just means they haven't done anything yet. But they will" is infuriating.
Yep--innocent people are the most dangerous.
So I've heard. I could damn near be a terrorist under that logic.
Yep. We're not in Minority Report territory....yet.
Yet....
Doesn't that apply to the entire cabinet?
But put DOJ in CECOT in the migrants’ place.
Put fucking Stephen Miller in CECOT! We can rail on about Trump and we should, but Stephen Miller is beneath contempt! This is his baby. May the world turn upside down on his NAZI head!
All this bloviating (about Greenland and Canada) by Bloviator in chief is a distraction to keep our attention away from the sinking stock market. As one insightful blog commentator said, "A big price to pay for the promise of cheaper eggs."
Yes, they should. And they can. They just choose not to. Hopefully justoce will prevail. Interesting 24 hours ahead.
Trump has no cajones at all. He's the most cowardly wimpiest person you'll ever see.
Excellent point!
From the song “Hurricane” by Bob Dylan: “Couldn’t help but make me feel ashamed to live in a land -Where justice is a game-Now all the criminals in their coats and ties are free to drink martinis and watch the sunrise…”. DISGUSTING!
So we are sending innocent people to a foreign prison? A prison in a country rife with gangs and its problems? They are sacrificing people's lives for political photo ops? Now they claim they can't get him back? They don't want to get him back. These people in our government are the worst in every way.
I don't consider this "our government." It's certainly not the one described by the U.S. Constitution.
But we did elect them. We need to own that whatever would have prevented this is not what we did. As a country.
yes... and it's working. His base believes these deportations are good, they are getting rid of gangs and criminals. But they also believe muskrat is finding fraud and waste so....
A "prison" notorious for inhumane conditions and abuse of prisoners.
It's a setup just like the one in nazi Germany when one could call authorities and claim a Jew, homosexual, gypsy, etc. was staying nextdoor and one could have his annoying neighbors disappeared. That will be the MO next if this is allowed to stand.
As someone who has been through the US Immigration torture... I mean system.... (which was bad enough without being thrown in jail) I cannot imagine what this poor man is going through right now. Or his family. This is insane! I hope he survives. I hope we can bring him back soon.
My fear is that when these evil people in government say they can’t bring him back what they mean is that the gangs in that prison have already tortured and killed him.
That's what I am afraid of too. One of my step-cousins in Ukraine - a soldier - is a POW in Russian custody, and my heart goes out to the family of this poor man, because it is very likely he is treated worse in that horrid prison than Ukrainian POWs are in Russian custody.
They all need to be brought back.
Truth.
Lines are being drawn now… The White House stubbornness is breathtaking here and as they continue to brazenly break the law, who will enforce it? 😳
This may be the case that breaks the fever. It seems so clear-cut that if there is any justice left in America, someone at a high level will be held to account. Failing that, I propose we offer to trade trump for Garcia, and throw in vance and musk.
I like your negotiating style. I nominate you for the Head of Immigration Negotiation Agency. You don't need to be vetted, just show up and act like you belong there
Just got to get added to the right Signal chat. Extra points for having been a TV personality at some point.
LOL
💯
Your mouth to God’s ear, Dude.
Hard to see Alito and Thomas being okay with this. Anything less than 9-0 for Garcia would be a disgrace.
What's one more 2nd class of citizen to Alito and Thomas?
Have Alito and Thomas EVER voted for anything other than the most conservative/rightwing side?
Alito and Thomas will be all in for this. Kavanaugh will be, too, most likely. Roberts and Cone Barrett may be sane enough to oppose Trump here. Maybe.
Maybe
That may be a failure of imagination on your part. Time will tell.
“At my direction, every Department of Justice attorney is required to zealously advocate on behalf of the United States,” AG Bondi wrote in a statement to The Times. “Any attorney who fails to abide by this direction will face consequences”.”
Perhaps AG Bondi should be forced to represent the Department of Justice in this case? Just asking for a friend.
Apparently there's no room for truth in the concept of "zealous advocacy." Good lawyers are also officers of the court of justice.
Maybe send Krysti Noam down to pick him up? She is familiar, with the layout, after making that awful TV spot.
That we are sending anyone to a foreign prison paid for with out tax dollars is horrific. The only reason I can see that they would send people to a foreign prison is because it is easier to just disappear people. And when the prisons are hellholes there won't be any media coverage of US citizens protesting outside the prisons because the prisons are in a foreign country.
i was surprised too, i assumed that a slave labor camp would be paying him for whoever he decides to send. art of the deal.
Remember We (well GW Bush's government in our name) have done this before after 9/11. The CIA imprisoned and tortured suspected terrorists overseas. They did not always get the right people. It was wrong then and now.
With virtually no ramifications for the people who caused it. So here we are.
To my shame I forgot about that.
I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of it is the drama, the visual, meant to scare people.
Absolutely it is scare tactics. Now it is to scare immigrants to as they say "self deport" but it will be used against all of us to suppress free speech.
And the DOJ attorney acting for the govt., Erez Reuveni, was promptly suspended by Oberfűhrer Bondi, as was HIS boss, August Flentje, for essentially talking outside of school by admitting the deportation fuckup.
But the "Signalgate" crowd continue in their jobs, without fear of accountability because tRump...what an administration, one FUBAR after another, without cessation.
I'm unclear on why the judge can't summon Bondi's butt before her court to explain what she suspended Reuveni for not explaining.
And then hold Bondi in contempt if she fails to give satisfactory answers (and perhaps Noem, too!).
Thanks for this exposition. Most of us knew it is inevitable that indiscriminate roundups by law enforcement officials with poor oversight and hasty detention without due process leads to injustice. And wreckage of lives, families, communities. The diminishment of our entire society by creating a legal sub-basement.
[Small detail of fact that you might want to correct: the habit-forming food is pupusa. A place that makes them: pupuseria. Like tacos and taquerias.]
How long before DHS "accidentally" starts sending US Citizens to the prisons in El Salvador with no due process?
I have a close friend. Born in San Diego. Very Brown. He’s terrified of this.
Everyone knows we’re paying 6 million to El Salvador for this privilege of jailing perfectly law abiding, non-violent human beings! (Minus about a dozen of them)
I'm worried about what happens when this gets to SCOTUS. Lawyer Elie Mystal says SCOTUS isn't going to want a showdown with Trump wherein he has all the power because he'll flaunt their authority and they'll be rendered toothless (the argument that THIS court probably should be is for another time). Mr. Garcia deserves justice, so his case needs to be brought but we should brace ourselves. Will SCOTUS completely bend the knee or will it lead to a constitutional crisis? Of course, bullies do tend to back down when confronted but this regime is a wild card.
What happens if SCOTUS does bend the knee? That may be a constitutional crisis itself.
I’ve wondered this all along — how will the judicial branch MAKE the executive branch obey the law? I haven’t figured it out yet and apparently neither has the judicial branch.
No system is perfect with bad actors.
The court could expose the wrong doing in the most dramatic way possible, thereby compelling the congress to impeach. It's all about the level of outrage that can be inspired by a judicial drama.
Impeach? Where have you been?
If they vote against due process, we are lost. I would be very surprised. Of course Alito and Thomas won't, but they won't have the deciding votes. Interesting (frightening) hours ahead.
Given that we are already in a constitutional crisis, perhaps this case would most blatantly place us in a constitutional crisis?
If that happens under these facts, the Constitution will not be in crisis, it will be dead.
Great job of summing this up, Jay. It is a frightening and disgusting move by the government. I’m afraid the government may order Abrego Garcia killed to avoid returning him. I would put nothing past them.
I'll bet this administration will have Mr. Garcia killed and left in that prison and then say "ooops, too late!" before they admit their error and even try to bring him home.
In 2020, Vanessa Guillén, a soldier was murdered and dismembered inside an armory at Ft. Hood (now Cavasos). The Army tried to sweep their responsibility under the rug, but Guillén’s sister was on TV and any media that would have her, keeping this in the news and finally there was a law passed requiring the military to report sexual harassment up the chain of command. Her sister made it happen. I hope that Kilmer’s family can do the same.
I was just thinking the same thing.
:(
As a Holocaust scholar, this entire business of shipping people to El Salvador terrifies me to no end. I do hope and pray those men are still alive because 1. it's easier to kill mass numbers of people if you transport them well away from anyone who might complain, and 2. the only possible way you could NOT return someone from a prison where you sent them -- regardless of where the prison is -- is if they're dead.