I am confused as to why people think the FBI has ever been free from politics. Take a look at J. Edgar Hoover's reign. He set the stage for people like trump, Roy Cohn and others.
I would add, people, individuals, in the FBI are not immune to the idiocy of the day just because they are trained agents. No humans are infallible and agents are humans. It does not forgive that they gave in to their baser instincts it shows that they are just as susceptible as anyone else.
“it shows that they are just as susceptible as anyone else”
Yes, they are humans. But they’re also supposed to be held to a higher standard. They’re supposed to hold THEMSELVES to a higher standard. And should they fail in that their coworkers are supposed to hold them to a higher standard.
It would be unfair to expect them to be perfect. But they are to be better than average.  it’s a requirement of the job. And if they can’t meet that standard, they should not have the job. 
Precisely what I came here to say. Even allowing for personal political beliefs, I believe it is literally their job to protect and serve on behalf of the people and their duly elected government. If they can’t do that, they should be gone. Typical of the Insurrection Caucus to have more insurrectionists “investigating” themselves.
FBI Agent, like every other civil servant job, means putting your personal views aside and serving the public.
Anyone who can’t do that, we doesn’t recognize that, should not apply for one of those jobs. And if they do, should be screened out as a basic part of the process.
For example, the job of being a police officer means you’re going to have to put yourself at risk. That you’re going to have to willingly deal with situations where you may have to purposely risk getting injured. That you're going to have to risk getting shot yourself rather than shoot at someone holding a cell phone because you can't tell it's not a gun.
And if you don’t recognize that, if you’re unwilling to recognize that, and do that, if your first reaction at the slightest sign of possible risk is to pull out your gun and shoot somebody, then you should not be a police officer.
I was a Public Service Telecommunicator (dispatcher) for more than one police department. Local, county, then state. At one point, for the county sheriff's department. While I was training, I asked one of the trainers what the sheriff's political affiliation was (because here, as in many places, they're elected officials with party affiliation). She told me, and I said, "Well what if one disagrees with his political policies?" She said, "Then you keep your f**king mouth shut and do your f**king job." I quit a week later.
Mr. Foxx, do you think Rep. Jordan meets the standards of his job? Do we forgive him because he is human? Do you believe his "coworkers" will hold him to a higher standard? As for me, I just don't know what to believe anymore.
No, because he’s not having occasional lapses in judgement or making inadvertent "we're all human" mistakes. He’s CONSIOUSLY, DELIBERATIVELY violating his oath and freely choosing to be evil.
No, because the Republicans are similarly vile and Democrats are wimps.
It's the wimpy part I don't understand. This is the most opportune time for us to POUNCE on the Republican dog-whistling. We need to jump on the deliberate violations, like Jon Stewart jumped on that Oklahoma congress idiot.
I get a certain hesitation, a "I can't really believe this is happening"-type pause. It is almost unbelievable how brazen and criminal Republicans are. And when faced with something truly outside any norms it's natural to react with a "Nah, that can't be right. They can't really have said/done that." disbelief.
But for the past 2-3 decades it HAS been the Republican norm. And pretending Greene and Jim Jordan and the former guy, and McCarthy, and Gaetz, and Boebert, and, and, and, aren't THE norm for the Republican party is suicidal.
Sure, you couldn't believe it when your brother first pulled a knife on you. But he's done it for years now and to pretend he can be reasoned with rather than putting down HARD is insane.
The point of the commenter, I believe, is to note the hypocrisy of the far right, whose heroes include J. Edgar Hoover, who was secretly gay and loved drag and would have been the first to be charged under these new laws in Tennessee, e.g.
Where did you come up with the supporting evidence that J Edgar Hoover was a hero of the far right? Jay your statements seem to consistently lack balance and clear perspective.
There is a lot to unpack here. Are these just rogue political players or are they assets to a foreign government? Why did the 1/6 committee drop their investigation (or at least drop it from their final report) of failings of the FBI, Secret Service, and military given the obvious and fairly well publicized information coming in from weeks off social media? Exactly how did McGonigal end up on an oligarch's payroll? Was the timing of his relocation to NYC and the behavior of the FBI in the closing days of 2016 serendipity or was more in play?
The FBI has never been a paragon of virtue, starting with J. Edgar Hoover. I think Wray should be hauled in front of the Senate for an accounting, and take things from there.
Nothing about TFG's era can be resolved without a cold, hard, meticulously researched examination of the FBI (and Secret Service).
What boggles my mind still to this day is how these people are stating that January 6 was bullshit. I was on CSPAN - I saw what was going down up until they cut away the feed inside the chamber. Then I went to all the news outlets...we all saw what was the live feed on CSPAN. The audacity of gaslighting me on what I actually saw. GTFOH!
Thank you for this examination of what may be happening within the FBI. It would certainly explain a lot of what is currently happening in the US. Scary indeed.
BTW: love your reference to the “ renowned protecter of institutional integrity Rep. Jim Jordan (R-OH)”. 😂🤣
Thank you for this. I was wondering what happened to the whistleblowers Jordan promised. I'm sure there was always corruption in the FBI, CIA, etc., but just like everything else, Trump has allowed these Ultra Magas to feel like they can now do everything out in the open with no repercussions.
Who watches the watchmen? Good question to ask when the elements within the DOJ look to be compromised, but then this is nothing new, going back to the days of J. Edgar Hoover. Some serious housecleaning looks to be in order here, but who’s going to do it? And when?
One of the most egregious acts of the former president was to undermine the workings of agencies of government, firing experienced personnel and replacing them with inexperienced sycophants who would do his bidding.
He turns everything he touches into something that will work for him, and serve him and his plan. He knows what he's doing. It's not for the best of the people, it's for the best of TFG.
Since my youth was spent during Vietnam, I had a dim view of the FBI in general. In fact, my then husband and I were apparently under investigation, though we never knew why--we opposed the war but weren't particularly activist. My husband came home early and found guys from a car with government plates in our driveway taking pictures through the living room window. Nothing happened thereafter, despite the fact that they had to have included in their photos the little statuette of Lenin I'd gotten as a souvenir from a college trip to the Soviet Union. But it didn't make us feel warm and cozy.
Over the years, some trust was regained. On non-political issues like kidnappings or serial killers they seemed to do a good job.
I don't think discovery of rogue agents makes the whole department corrupt. In retrospect I think that kidnapping/serial killers etc. probably went on and were caught even in the Vietnam era. I have read of infiltrations of far-right types into other police agencies--the Right would be remiss in its authoritarian aims if it neglected the FBI.
What needs to happen is a crackdown, a purge if you will, of people who act out their political views while investigating any issues, and more so of people who actively interfere with investigations because they actually have a political agenda.
Even agents are allowed to HAVE political views and express them in private. Peter Strzok is the poster boy for claims that simply having them means they can't act objectively. The test should be if their ACTIONS violate their oath of office or the protocols that govern them. Leaks in ongoing investigations are a prime example.
Agents involved in the Hunter Biden Laptop issue have been admirably, if maddingly, silent until the investigation is done. That, of course, has fueled rightwing claims that the FBI has been stonewalling the investigations, but those claims lack any evidence given the silence. The FBI has the laptop and no one at all outside the investigators has any idea at all what is on it. Not even Repair guy, since what he found was the result of what HE could extract from the broken drive and might not represent what can actually found on it by other forensic analysts. That's the way things should be done.
The issue, in short, seems to be activated political bias. On the myriad other issues the FBI handles I don't see reports of any actual incompetence by FBI agents as a whole.
I suspect about the same as any organization: a large bank, an organized Church, etc. Not sure what you mean by incompetence. I'm pretty sure they have a record of cases solved or not solved, cases lost because of evidence screwups, cases where chain of custody was broken, etc. It is pretty clear from the record of Jordan's "whistleblowers" that they discipline agents for a variety of reasons; I have no idea what a FOIA request would result it, but obviously the Dem Report was able to get the info.
All organizations are made up of people, flawed people with political biases and sets of beliefs that drive their decisions. No matter how many checks and balances are put into place in the organization, we can't stop the people in that organization from acting on their beliefs. Teaching people to recognize their biases and the role of those biases in their decision-making is our best tool.
People love to live in their biases. It is soooo hard to create a wake-up moment for them. I would love for foundational human biases to be taught in the classroom.
I was about to ask the same question. "We believe that covid was due to a lab leak. Not that we have any evidence or that we are virologists, but I thought you should know what our opinion is on the matter." Feeding conspiracy theories, but not providing any answers or comfort to Americans. It reminds me of GWB's constant announcements that "we are setting the threat level today at very dark orange, be afraid! No information on what the threat is, where it might be, or how you can minimize your risk. Just wanted you to be afraid"
If Garland or Biden fires Wray, it may drive even more within the FBI to extreme positions, claiming it is a partisan attack. It’s very dicey times right now at the Dept.
Spot on Jay ... "certain agents" & certain FBI offices such as the FBI NY office ( meaning "certain agents") impact on James Comey in the last 10 days of the 2016 Presidential Election.
Yes!! Thankfully. We are relatively new Michiganders, having moved here 2 years ago. Previously lived in the South where we were electorally invisible. Much prefer Michigan!
Thank you, Jay. Sometimes it is hard to keep track of all the players. I wish there was a webpage that laid out who everyone is,what their official role is, and what they are up to. That said, creating a complex visual of all this probably would crash the Internet.
I am confused as to why people think the FBI has ever been free from politics. Take a look at J. Edgar Hoover's reign. He set the stage for people like trump, Roy Cohn and others.
I would add, people, individuals, in the FBI are not immune to the idiocy of the day just because they are trained agents. No humans are infallible and agents are humans. It does not forgive that they gave in to their baser instincts it shows that they are just as susceptible as anyone else.
“it shows that they are just as susceptible as anyone else”
Yes, they are humans. But they’re also supposed to be held to a higher standard. They’re supposed to hold THEMSELVES to a higher standard. And should they fail in that their coworkers are supposed to hold them to a higher standard.
It would be unfair to expect them to be perfect. But they are to be better than average.  it’s a requirement of the job. And if they can’t meet that standard, they should not have the job. 
Precisely what I came here to say. Even allowing for personal political beliefs, I believe it is literally their job to protect and serve on behalf of the people and their duly elected government. If they can’t do that, they should be gone. Typical of the Insurrection Caucus to have more insurrectionists “investigating” themselves.
FBI Agent, like every other civil servant job, means putting your personal views aside and serving the public.
Anyone who can’t do that, we doesn’t recognize that, should not apply for one of those jobs. And if they do, should be screened out as a basic part of the process.
For example, the job of being a police officer means you’re going to have to put yourself at risk. That you’re going to have to willingly deal with situations where you may have to purposely risk getting injured. That you're going to have to risk getting shot yourself rather than shoot at someone holding a cell phone because you can't tell it's not a gun.
And if you don’t recognize that, if you’re unwilling to recognize that, and do that, if your first reaction at the slightest sign of possible risk is to pull out your gun and shoot somebody, then you should not be a police officer.
I was a Public Service Telecommunicator (dispatcher) for more than one police department. Local, county, then state. At one point, for the county sheriff's department. While I was training, I asked one of the trainers what the sheriff's political affiliation was (because here, as in many places, they're elected officials with party affiliation). She told me, and I said, "Well what if one disagrees with his political policies?" She said, "Then you keep your f**king mouth shut and do your f**king job." I quit a week later.
And yet, people claim there's no systemic politicization in departments like that.
Mr. Foxx, do you think Rep. Jordan meets the standards of his job? Do we forgive him because he is human? Do you believe his "coworkers" will hold him to a higher standard? As for me, I just don't know what to believe anymore.
No, obviously not.
No, because he’s not having occasional lapses in judgement or making inadvertent "we're all human" mistakes. He’s CONSIOUSLY, DELIBERATIVELY violating his oath and freely choosing to be evil.
No, because the Republicans are similarly vile and Democrats are wimps.
It's the wimpy part I don't understand. This is the most opportune time for us to POUNCE on the Republican dog-whistling. We need to jump on the deliberate violations, like Jon Stewart jumped on that Oklahoma congress idiot.
Agreed.
I get a certain hesitation, a "I can't really believe this is happening"-type pause. It is almost unbelievable how brazen and criminal Republicans are. And when faced with something truly outside any norms it's natural to react with a "Nah, that can't be right. They can't really have said/done that." disbelief.
But for the past 2-3 decades it HAS been the Republican norm. And pretending Greene and Jim Jordan and the former guy, and McCarthy, and Gaetz, and Boebert, and, and, and, aren't THE norm for the Republican party is suicidal.
Sure, you couldn't believe it when your brother first pulled a knife on you. But he's done it for years now and to pretend he can be reasoned with rather than putting down HARD is insane.
Yes. And Hoover did it in drag.
Whether someone is a drag queen etc. has no bearing on their morals.
The point of the commenter, I believe, is to note the hypocrisy of the far right, whose heroes include J. Edgar Hoover, who was secretly gay and loved drag and would have been the first to be charged under these new laws in Tennessee, e.g.
What does the commenter say on this?
Where did you come up with the supporting evidence that J Edgar Hoover was a hero of the far right? Jay your statements seem to consistently lack balance and clear perspective.
But sometimes on their hypocrisy
Hypocrisy on what? People in drag aren't required to be more pure than people who don't wear drag.
This is a great comment!
There is a lot to unpack here. Are these just rogue political players or are they assets to a foreign government? Why did the 1/6 committee drop their investigation (or at least drop it from their final report) of failings of the FBI, Secret Service, and military given the obvious and fairly well publicized information coming in from weeks off social media? Exactly how did McGonigal end up on an oligarch's payroll? Was the timing of his relocation to NYC and the behavior of the FBI in the closing days of 2016 serendipity or was more in play?
The FBI has never been a paragon of virtue, starting with J. Edgar Hoover. I think Wray should be hauled in front of the Senate for an accounting, and take things from there.
Nothing about TFG's era can be resolved without a cold, hard, meticulously researched examination of the FBI (and Secret Service).
What boggles my mind still to this day is how these people are stating that January 6 was bullshit. I was on CSPAN - I saw what was going down up until they cut away the feed inside the chamber. Then I went to all the news outlets...we all saw what was the live feed on CSPAN. The audacity of gaslighting me on what I actually saw. GTFOH!
Thank you for this examination of what may be happening within the FBI. It would certainly explain a lot of what is currently happening in the US. Scary indeed.
BTW: love your reference to the “ renowned protecter of institutional integrity Rep. Jim Jordan (R-OH)”. 😂🤣
Thank you for this. I was wondering what happened to the whistleblowers Jordan promised. I'm sure there was always corruption in the FBI, CIA, etc., but just like everything else, Trump has allowed these Ultra Magas to feel like they can now do everything out in the open with no repercussions.
Your work is much appreciated
Who watches the watchmen? Good question to ask when the elements within the DOJ look to be compromised, but then this is nothing new, going back to the days of J. Edgar Hoover. Some serious housecleaning looks to be in order here, but who’s going to do it? And when?
One of the most egregious acts of the former president was to undermine the workings of agencies of government, firing experienced personnel and replacing them with inexperienced sycophants who would do his bidding.
TFG is extremely competent at making everything he touches incompetent. Sorry - couldn't help myself! He destroys everything!
He turns everything he touches into something that will work for him, and serve him and his plan. He knows what he's doing. It's not for the best of the people, it's for the best of TFG.
Since my youth was spent during Vietnam, I had a dim view of the FBI in general. In fact, my then husband and I were apparently under investigation, though we never knew why--we opposed the war but weren't particularly activist. My husband came home early and found guys from a car with government plates in our driveway taking pictures through the living room window. Nothing happened thereafter, despite the fact that they had to have included in their photos the little statuette of Lenin I'd gotten as a souvenir from a college trip to the Soviet Union. But it didn't make us feel warm and cozy.
Over the years, some trust was regained. On non-political issues like kidnappings or serial killers they seemed to do a good job.
I don't think discovery of rogue agents makes the whole department corrupt. In retrospect I think that kidnapping/serial killers etc. probably went on and were caught even in the Vietnam era. I have read of infiltrations of far-right types into other police agencies--the Right would be remiss in its authoritarian aims if it neglected the FBI.
What needs to happen is a crackdown, a purge if you will, of people who act out their political views while investigating any issues, and more so of people who actively interfere with investigations because they actually have a political agenda.
Even agents are allowed to HAVE political views and express them in private. Peter Strzok is the poster boy for claims that simply having them means they can't act objectively. The test should be if their ACTIONS violate their oath of office or the protocols that govern them. Leaks in ongoing investigations are a prime example.
Agents involved in the Hunter Biden Laptop issue have been admirably, if maddingly, silent until the investigation is done. That, of course, has fueled rightwing claims that the FBI has been stonewalling the investigations, but those claims lack any evidence given the silence. The FBI has the laptop and no one at all outside the investigators has any idea at all what is on it. Not even Repair guy, since what he found was the result of what HE could extract from the broken drive and might not represent what can actually found on it by other forensic analysts. That's the way things should be done.
The issue, in short, seems to be activated political bias. On the myriad other issues the FBI handles I don't see reports of any actual incompetence by FBI agents as a whole.
Well said.
Does the FBI report on its own incompetence? And if they did would they make it public?
I suspect about the same as any organization: a large bank, an organized Church, etc. Not sure what you mean by incompetence. I'm pretty sure they have a record of cases solved or not solved, cases lost because of evidence screwups, cases where chain of custody was broken, etc. It is pretty clear from the record of Jordan's "whistleblowers" that they discipline agents for a variety of reasons; I have no idea what a FOIA request would result it, but obviously the Dem Report was able to get the info.
All organizations are made up of people, flawed people with political biases and sets of beliefs that drive their decisions. No matter how many checks and balances are put into place in the organization, we can't stop the people in that organization from acting on their beliefs. Teaching people to recognize their biases and the role of those biases in their decision-making is our best tool.
People love to live in their biases. It is soooo hard to create a wake-up moment for them. I would love for foundational human biases to be taught in the classroom.
Ask any old former Black Panther Party member about the FBI, and it will be clear how rotten is has been for quite some time.
How, then, does Christopher Wray fit into this puzzle? Especially given his recent interview with Faux News re the origins of covid.
I was about to ask the same question. "We believe that covid was due to a lab leak. Not that we have any evidence or that we are virologists, but I thought you should know what our opinion is on the matter." Feeding conspiracy theories, but not providing any answers or comfort to Americans. It reminds me of GWB's constant announcements that "we are setting the threat level today at very dark orange, be afraid! No information on what the threat is, where it might be, or how you can minimize your risk. Just wanted you to be afraid"
And why is Wray still there?
If Garland or Biden fires Wray, it may drive even more within the FBI to extreme positions, claiming it is a partisan attack. It’s very dicey times right now at the Dept.
Spot on Jay ... "certain agents" & certain FBI offices such as the FBI NY office ( meaning "certain agents") impact on James Comey in the last 10 days of the 2016 Presidential Election.
The first boulder of the painfully destructive rock slide we've all experienced over the last 8 years (starting with 2015 R primaries run-up).
But, Michigan has dealt with Gerrymandering, no? :)
Yes!! Thankfully. We are relatively new Michiganders, having moved here 2 years ago. Previously lived in the South where we were electorally invisible. Much prefer Michigan!
Thank you, Jay. Sometimes it is hard to keep track of all the players. I wish there was a webpage that laid out who everyone is,what their official role is, and what they are up to. That said, creating a complex visual of all this probably would crash the Internet.
People have tried…
I haven't even finished reading and had to say, thank you for this, as good as any funny you post on Saturdays;
new House “Weaponization of the Federal Government” subcommittee, run by renowned protector of institutional integrity Rep. Jim Jordan (R-OH).
Important read, thanks Jo. Something on the inside is rotting…