Tens of thousands of protestors poured into the streets across cities in Israel yesterday following the sacking of the Israeli Defense Minister, Yoav Gallant.
One key difference is the ability of the Democracies to dissolve their governments and oust a leader. We have no such thing here, and are basically stuck with these idiots who gerrymander to assure their hold. Politics here has become a profession, and it was never intended to be that way. Politicians should not be able to enrich themselves through election. Our system has become horribly broken.
True. Sadly, though, that feature didn’t stop Netanyahu from gaining power despite being criminally charged, and it didn’t stop him from seeking to cement that power with these “reforms.” Democratic safeguards need to be strengthened in each country.
Then go to www.termlimits.com and sign up. Get your neighbors to sign up. Anyone you know. This is, to my limited knowledge, the ONLY way right now to put a stop to these "career politicians".
Clean up having Lobbyists literally writing the legal statutes, and it is long term Congressional Staff that read them throughly & tell their Congressman whether to sponsor it & how to vote on it.
Netanyahu suspended the measure a couple of hours ago.
That Israel is a parliamentary democracy could be a good thing in this mess, especially because Netanyahu's coalition is so cobbled together. That said, the similarities to the US are striking, and Bibi is just as much a crook as TFG. I'm please the Israelis have taken to the streets with such force, now perhaps they won't vote for him ever again.
I think he's boxed. His majority is so slim, and the riots in the streets so stark. He's like TFG, he'll do anything, offer anything, but can he deliver without losing his majority?
Let's not forget to add Narendra Modi of India to the list. He is currently conducting pogroms, and RSS nationalism traces directly back to Nazi links in 1925.
Americans have become fat and complacent. I don't see the same kind of protesting ever taking place. We seem to just roll with the flow, which is, of course, a danger to democracy.
Not really. Protesting is one form of activism. Effective in some situations, counter-productive in others. We saw plenty of it here during Trump administration. Other measures of activism include voting (way up), new candidates running for office (way up), grassroots fundraising (way up).
MAGA feeds on negative and defeatist sentiment (e.g., "fat and happy", "we're doomed", etc.) Don't give in.
But there is a greater degree of engagement now- case in point, this and similar communities- and I see we the people as manifest in this space absolutely being roused to protest.
We could start an action-based offshoot of this group, in fact, with state chapters...
Through the struggles in Israel we are bestowed the unusual perspective of watching a facsimile of ourselves under the next stage of duress, as if in a portentous dream. This should provide no uncertain incentive to drop kick DJT and friends way into the heart of the Mariana Trench of Never Again.
There are many major differences between the U.S. and Israeli flavors of democracy, only a few of which have been mentioned.
The biggest is that Israel has no constitution. There is no clean separation between religion and state - indeed, religious parties hold far greater sway than the numbers they represent. Which is due mainly to another key difference: a proportional representation party system. This is, in theory, much more democratic than our own system, however, unlike many successful nations that use proportional rep, Israel has an unusually low (3%) threshhold to qualify parties, which means that there are far more splinter parties (and the petty, though impactful conflicts they generate) than in countries that use a higher qualifying threshhold. Israel has always relied on a much weaker system of checks and balances than we have, with the courts and the citizen recall and threat of dissolution as the only real mechanisms to oppose highly controversial or outright illegal policies and decisions. Eventually, Israelis will need to fix these foundational problems. Whether the current crisis will be the impetus remains to be seen, though most likely, they will be kicked down the road in favor of bandaids, only to be (hopefully) addressed some day when the people are ready.
To your first point, the "clean separation between religion and state"- I would argue that under the current political climate those lines are no longer clean. With extremists in power and tRump appointees on the Supreme Court we are pushing those boundaries, with Roe v Wade being the obvious example. The anti abortion and anti LGTBQ movements are brought about by a ruse of "Christian beliefs" and the laws created to force those beliefs on others- not that I'm saying all Christians think this way (I know that not to be true).
Taken from the side of what we would imagine democracy would look like, this was a great read. This is not a criticism, but I just wanted to also remind people of the chaos inflicted towards Palestinians that are also happening during these (also utterly important) protests as well. 🤝👍
We are already there check out what the Republicans are saying about Alvin Braggs? Why do they even consider what a State is inditing a Private Citizen? They also what the documents and proof of his crimes ? They are claiming to see if they have PROOF
It just baffles me to watch conservative Jews in the ruling party, considering their history in Nazi Germany where the Nazi party essentially took over the courts, support their government exerting power over the judiciary in this way. Power hungry people will just never learn.
We condemned this behavior all over the world! we've started wars because some countries displayed anti-democratic tendencies (looking at Iraq here).
The difference here is ANY ANY ANY criticism of the State of Israel, not its peoples, or religions, would be labelled as anti-semitic. Yes, the word-that-must-not-be-said...
Why has the STATE of Israel has gotten away with more and more conservative rule over time leading to authoritarianism. Who is there to question them? to refuse to fund them? to sanction them?
Trump's "win" in 2016 was an unlucky roll of the dice. Just enough conservative normies said "fuck it" and went along with the maniacs.
Since then, progressives have been beating MAGA at every turn. Trump's legal peril is exciting his shrinking base, but hardening majority opposition. Unlike Israel, the progressive majority is a growing segment of the US electorate and the maniacs are, um, aging out.
I mean, duh, we're always staring into the abyss because life and politics are uncertain. But I'd rather be us than them.
Trump didn't win at all in 2016. He just didn't lose quite as bad as Hillary Clinton did, and thus by default ended up as President. Both candidates were atrocious in the eyes of many Americans.
Why does this article Jay , make me think that Bannon and his creepy cohorts have something to do with the ongoing protests in the USA , Israel, Paris and other places ! That was the first thing I thought of...that evil person has his hooks into this !! Why do people like these evil, in for themselves only parasites ?? I cannot fathom why they would go against their own self interests to vote these half wits into power only to reduce or get rid of more freedoms for the people !!! I think it's time for the "we the people " to take back the country thru protests and voting these morons out ! You don't want a fascist or a theocratic country ! Can you imagine if all these protesting nations all become fascist !! Do you think that would be a better way to live ! Think about that people !!
There is a second factor at work here, at least in the US (I'm not familiar enough with Israeli politics): the other side doesn't have much to offer. That was particularly evidence in 2016, when Hillary Clinton ran essentially on a platform of "I'm not quite as bad as the other guy". 2020 was similar, although I have been pleasantly surprised by Biden; he is not quite as bad as I had expected.
The Republicans have learned their lesson from Ross Perot, much to our detriment. The Democrats have failed to learn their lesson from Ralph Nader, also to our detriment.
The former Arkansas First Lady, former FLOTUS that rammed through still-in-use State Children’s Health Insurance Plan , former U.S. Secretary of State and former New York Senator had “nothing to offer”??? She was one of the MOST qualified Candidates to ever run for POTUS.
Thankfully, we live in a democracy, where our opinions can differ. What matters here is that most Americans, outside the cities of LA and New York, seem to have felt the same way I felt.
The reasons are, of course, mine and mine only. For me, it was first, her attitude of "rules don't apply to me" that led to the email issue - while firing the US ambassador to Kenya for doing basically the same thing. Second, most of her positions being somewhere to the right of Reagan. Being close to Wall Street. the Bankruptcy Bill. being on the board of Walmart.
And her overall sense of entitlement; she always came across as "becoming President is my birthright".
Any one or two things could have been overlooked, but there just was so much.
Thanks for the concise analysis of a complex problem. It suggests the USA might be better served by a real multiparty legislative body. I can’t imagine getting a parliamentary system; but stronger caucuses embodying moderate “Center” views would really help. Maybe even a little AI to buttress budget oversight (CBO) expertise and analysis in an objective manner?
Multiparty legislative bodies are really worse than what we have in the USA. Israel's Knesset is a multiparty legislative body. All that does is give a handful of extremists veto power. And the US is effectively also a four-party system: economic libertarian Republicans, extremist Republicans, Reagan-Democrats (I can't bring myself to call them "Moderates") and Progressives.
I agree with you, but at least our Constitution has some basis of discussion and intention to separate religion from governance, even if the full nature and parameters of that separation are open to interpretation and debate. Israel has, by choice, none of that, and only the barest allusions to separation of civil and religious law.
One key difference is the ability of the Democracies to dissolve their governments and oust a leader. We have no such thing here, and are basically stuck with these idiots who gerrymander to assure their hold. Politics here has become a profession, and it was never intended to be that way. Politicians should not be able to enrich themselves through election. Our system has become horribly broken.
True. Sadly, though, that feature didn’t stop Netanyahu from gaining power despite being criminally charged, and it didn’t stop him from seeking to cement that power with these “reforms.” Democratic safeguards need to be strengthened in each country.
Then go to www.termlimits.com and sign up. Get your neighbors to sign up. Anyone you know. This is, to my limited knowledge, the ONLY way right now to put a stop to these "career politicians".
Clean up having Lobbyists literally writing the legal statutes, and it is long term Congressional Staff that read them throughly & tell their Congressman whether to sponsor it & how to vote on it.
Netanyahu suspended the measure a couple of hours ago.
That Israel is a parliamentary democracy could be a good thing in this mess, especially because Netanyahu's coalition is so cobbled together. That said, the similarities to the US are striking, and Bibi is just as much a crook as TFG. I'm please the Israelis have taken to the streets with such force, now perhaps they won't vote for him ever again.
I fear what he has offered the head of National Security in exchange for that delay.
I think he's boxed. His majority is so slim, and the riots in the streets so stark. He's like TFG, he'll do anything, offer anything, but can he deliver without losing his majority?
So tired of the snake pit.
Agree. I hope he loses his majority and that the extremists in his government go back to obscurity!
Clarion call, Jay! Thank you so much for carefully pulling these threads together ... we must keep our eyes open and our energy up.
Let's not forget to add Narendra Modi of India to the list. He is currently conducting pogroms, and RSS nationalism traces directly back to Nazi links in 1925.
And suppression of the media and dissent.
Americans have become fat and complacent. I don't see the same kind of protesting ever taking place. We seem to just roll with the flow, which is, of course, a danger to democracy.
Not really. Protesting is one form of activism. Effective in some situations, counter-productive in others. We saw plenty of it here during Trump administration. Other measures of activism include voting (way up), new candidates running for office (way up), grassroots fundraising (way up).
MAGA feeds on negative and defeatist sentiment (e.g., "fat and happy", "we're doomed", etc.) Don't give in.
But there is a greater degree of engagement now- case in point, this and similar communities- and I see we the people as manifest in this space absolutely being roused to protest.
We could start an action-based offshoot of this group, in fact, with state chapters...
Through the struggles in Israel we are bestowed the unusual perspective of watching a facsimile of ourselves under the next stage of duress, as if in a portentous dream. This should provide no uncertain incentive to drop kick DJT and friends way into the heart of the Mariana Trench of Never Again.
There are many major differences between the U.S. and Israeli flavors of democracy, only a few of which have been mentioned.
The biggest is that Israel has no constitution. There is no clean separation between religion and state - indeed, religious parties hold far greater sway than the numbers they represent. Which is due mainly to another key difference: a proportional representation party system. This is, in theory, much more democratic than our own system, however, unlike many successful nations that use proportional rep, Israel has an unusually low (3%) threshhold to qualify parties, which means that there are far more splinter parties (and the petty, though impactful conflicts they generate) than in countries that use a higher qualifying threshhold. Israel has always relied on a much weaker system of checks and balances than we have, with the courts and the citizen recall and threat of dissolution as the only real mechanisms to oppose highly controversial or outright illegal policies and decisions. Eventually, Israelis will need to fix these foundational problems. Whether the current crisis will be the impetus remains to be seen, though most likely, they will be kicked down the road in favor of bandaids, only to be (hopefully) addressed some day when the people are ready.
To your first point, the "clean separation between religion and state"- I would argue that under the current political climate those lines are no longer clean. With extremists in power and tRump appointees on the Supreme Court we are pushing those boundaries, with Roe v Wade being the obvious example. The anti abortion and anti LGTBQ movements are brought about by a ruse of "Christian beliefs" and the laws created to force those beliefs on others- not that I'm saying all Christians think this way (I know that not to be true).
Taken from the side of what we would imagine democracy would look like, this was a great read. This is not a criticism, but I just wanted to also remind people of the chaos inflicted towards Palestinians that are also happening during these (also utterly important) protests as well. 🤝👍
We are already there check out what the Republicans are saying about Alvin Braggs? Why do they even consider what a State is inditing a Private Citizen? They also what the documents and proof of his crimes ? They are claiming to see if they have PROOF
We are not already there. The legal system is working. Don't take the squealing of a dying, decrepit movement so seriously. Have some faith.
It just baffles me to watch conservative Jews in the ruling party, considering their history in Nazi Germany where the Nazi party essentially took over the courts, support their government exerting power over the judiciary in this way. Power hungry people will just never learn.
We condemned this behavior all over the world! we've started wars because some countries displayed anti-democratic tendencies (looking at Iraq here).
The difference here is ANY ANY ANY criticism of the State of Israel, not its peoples, or religions, would be labelled as anti-semitic. Yes, the word-that-must-not-be-said...
Why has the STATE of Israel has gotten away with more and more conservative rule over time leading to authoritarianism. Who is there to question them? to refuse to fund them? to sanction them?
Trump's "win" in 2016 was an unlucky roll of the dice. Just enough conservative normies said "fuck it" and went along with the maniacs.
Since then, progressives have been beating MAGA at every turn. Trump's legal peril is exciting his shrinking base, but hardening majority opposition. Unlike Israel, the progressive majority is a growing segment of the US electorate and the maniacs are, um, aging out.
I mean, duh, we're always staring into the abyss because life and politics are uncertain. But I'd rather be us than them.
Trump didn't win at all in 2016. He just didn't lose quite as bad as Hillary Clinton did, and thus by default ended up as President. Both candidates were atrocious in the eyes of many Americans.
I agree with that. I could never bring myself to vote for tRump but Hillary was also not high on my list of "great" candidates.
Why does this article Jay , make me think that Bannon and his creepy cohorts have something to do with the ongoing protests in the USA , Israel, Paris and other places ! That was the first thing I thought of...that evil person has his hooks into this !! Why do people like these evil, in for themselves only parasites ?? I cannot fathom why they would go against their own self interests to vote these half wits into power only to reduce or get rid of more freedoms for the people !!! I think it's time for the "we the people " to take back the country thru protests and voting these morons out ! You don't want a fascist or a theocratic country ! Can you imagine if all these protesting nations all become fascist !! Do you think that would be a better way to live ! Think about that people !!
There is a second factor at work here, at least in the US (I'm not familiar enough with Israeli politics): the other side doesn't have much to offer. That was particularly evidence in 2016, when Hillary Clinton ran essentially on a platform of "I'm not quite as bad as the other guy". 2020 was similar, although I have been pleasantly surprised by Biden; he is not quite as bad as I had expected.
The Republicans have learned their lesson from Ross Perot, much to our detriment. The Democrats have failed to learn their lesson from Ralph Nader, also to our detriment.
The former Arkansas First Lady, former FLOTUS that rammed through still-in-use State Children’s Health Insurance Plan , former U.S. Secretary of State and former New York Senator had “nothing to offer”??? She was one of the MOST qualified Candidates to ever run for POTUS.
Thankfully, we live in a democracy, where our opinions can differ. What matters here is that most Americans, outside the cities of LA and New York, seem to have felt the same way I felt.
The reasons are, of course, mine and mine only. For me, it was first, her attitude of "rules don't apply to me" that led to the email issue - while firing the US ambassador to Kenya for doing basically the same thing. Second, most of her positions being somewhere to the right of Reagan. Being close to Wall Street. the Bankruptcy Bill. being on the board of Walmart.
And her overall sense of entitlement; she always came across as "becoming President is my birthright".
Any one or two things could have been overlooked, but there just was so much.
Thanks for the concise analysis of a complex problem. It suggests the USA might be better served by a real multiparty legislative body. I can’t imagine getting a parliamentary system; but stronger caucuses embodying moderate “Center” views would really help. Maybe even a little AI to buttress budget oversight (CBO) expertise and analysis in an objective manner?
Multiparty legislative bodies are really worse than what we have in the USA. Israel's Knesset is a multiparty legislative body. All that does is give a handful of extremists veto power. And the US is effectively also a four-party system: economic libertarian Republicans, extremist Republicans, Reagan-Democrats (I can't bring myself to call them "Moderates") and Progressives.
I agree with you, but at least our Constitution has some basis of discussion and intention to separate religion from governance, even if the full nature and parameters of that separation are open to interpretation and debate. Israel has, by choice, none of that, and only the barest allusions to separation of civil and religious law.