He will never figure out that his behavior is the cause of his problems. He will keep throwing tantrums until he gets his way. He won't and will wail about the consequences, but he'll never figure out that it's his fault. After 70+ years of conditioning, I don't think that behavior can be modified.
Do you really think his behavior is calculated? I'm thinking he's so sick that he can't help himself. And he's so used to getting away with everything he does, it doesn't occur to him that he's making things worse and this time is different.
He will not stop, ever. He will violate every order, every requirement, until the only thing left to do is put him in jail. He’s daring the judge to do that. It’s a dominance thing that domestic abusers like him do.
I agree with Toby Koch. My hope is the legal system continues to methodically do what they're doing. Huge amount of respect for Jack Smith. This bs needs to end.
Jack Smith has dealt with war criminals, Judge Shutkan has handled Jan6 "shock troops", but neither of them have confronted a defendant for whom court proceedings are treated as a blood sport, and who has spent much of his adult life contesting all matter of civil suits. And he hasn't changed his MO now even in criminal cases, as he seemingly has a bottomless well of funding for his courtroom roguery, and can finance all matter of legal chicanery to keep justice at bay.
Long row to hoe for the SC, no matter how willing a presiding judge is to hasten matters forward.
At this point I'm pretty sure Trump WANTS to be have his release revoked, if only for a few days of jail time. You have to consider he will blatantly lie about it and frame it as a desperate Biden persecuting him to win the election. "All I did was post that Biden is corrupt and the next thing you know, they throw me in jail!"
You KNOW his base will believe it without question. And unfortunately, the GOP leadership will support the narrative and about 70% of all Republicans will too.
That's the beauty of having him spend only one night in jail. It's much harder to spin a single night this way, but may be enough to scare him straight.
The much bigger fear is that a large share of corrections officers are Trump supporters, and may make his stay far more comfortable than he deserves.
That would be both morally problematic as well as cause major political problems.
Morally, because nobody deserves to die for their crime - not even Trump (assuming he is guilty, which he hasn't yet found to be).
And politically because all that would do is make him a martyr, and provide the basis for yet more conspiracy theories. Just look at what's already swirling around Epstein's death.
A much better outcome for the nation, albeit one we cannot influence, would be Kenneth Lay style. At Trump's age and health status, he may well die a natural death.
Unfortunately, I think he has very strong support in the law enforcement and military community no matter where you go. In DC, Jan 6 may have shifted that a bit, but probably not enough.
S. P: Yes, his base will believe what he says and do what he wants. It doesn't matter if he goes to jail. He wants violence and he'll get it from his cult. So what if the base and the Republicans/Trumpians support the narrative? They already do. The threatening, the bullying will never stop. I'm tired of it.
Wondering if sanctions imposed on TFG’s temporary lawyer Lauro at the same time and to the same extent as any applied to TFG might influence the situation? Hmmm...
Just like was said before, if you don't want to be tried in DC, don't commit crimes in DC, simple!!! Also LOCK HIM UP. It is the only way to shut him up. He can meet with his lawyers there with extra hours allowed to work on his case ... another simple solution!
I don’t find it simple, but it is a solution. We don’t want the fight over his pre-trial detention to turn into the main storyline. That makes everything seem like a battle over free speech, which it isn’t. We need to play this smart.
Jay you’re right, of course. Trump is no ordinary criminal. The judge has her work cut out, for sure. Like the others here, I’m anxious to get him in court and hopefully in jail. But yes, gotta be patient. I’m very confident in Jack Smith and his team. 👍🏻
"Trump will turn every minor procedural skirmish into World War III and every serious matter into armageddon. There’s no real way for a reasonable judge to balance that kind of strategy in a way that doesn’t allow for at least some delays."
It’s the whole line… “How do you solve a problem like Herr Cheeto”… from someone who loves, writes and produces musicals. I actually sang it out loud, in that lilting way…
Maybe his anger will kill him! All that boiling, and if he is restrained so that he has no outlet for his rage, he might just explode, literally. (I can just see it, although every thought I have of this man-child is so terribly disturbing!)
Hah...I agree completely! All that rage needs an outlet and if Trumpy can't vent online or throw catsup on walls...maybe, just maybe, we can be witness to a trumptantrum resulting in a complete physical blowout. Undoubtedly this makes me a bad person, but I'm rooting for a CVA or an MI...however, TBH, I really don't care; do you?
Thanks Jay. I'll share this on FB. However, it seems to me that the real, long-term solution to Trump is for Americans to turn out in force on Election Day in 2024, reelect Biden with a strong majority (as well as holding the Senate and turning the House), and remove any possibility that Baby Donald Smallhands the Insane is able to regain power and pardon himself, which is clearly what his long-term, long-shot strategy is.
YES!!! I read somewhere that we cannot depend on Jack Smith (or any super hero) to 'save' us. We must save ourselves and the country through as much hard work as we are able to muster.
We allowed this situation to grow and ripen for many years...now we must deal with the noxious fruit that our former comfort & apathy created. Motivate the Millennials and Gen X's to vote, join grassroot progressive or Dem organizations, volunteer to work at the polls during voting time, offer rides and help for registering new voters, offer rides to the polls in November. Leave no election unvoted... We can do this.
You always make me feel better about all this chaos. He’s always calling for violence and it’s exhausting. We must get rid of him and his Maga minions must be put down.
The point is, in DC tRump has "won" an extra courtroom week by filing a lengthly - but probably failing - motion to not only broadcast freely via SM all but a few selected bits of evidence as HE sees fit, but also to bring on board "volunteer attorneys" to share in the discovery. And his lead lawyer also let out that tRump is "demanding" a recusal order for Judge Shutkan, but no decision on that motion has been reached. So, delay-delay-delay...as one motion gets tossed, yet another is filed in its place. Yes, the judge is trying to run a tight ship, but with such an unprecedented defendant as "Mister" tRump, lengthening of routine court practices is unavoidable, which of course IS his defense "strategy".
And the situation in Fort Pierce in the docs case has blown up, with *Judge* Cannon acting as Defendant Nauta's counsel, by suggesting HE file a motion questioning the use of TWO grand juries in sending up indictments...extra two weeks gained by the Defendants there. Then she rejected the government's request to seal the so-called "Garcia" hearing into the attorney, Stanley Woodward, and potential conflict-of-interest regarding multiple-client representation. After a few quiet weeks, *Judge* Cannon is now showing her true colors, and perhaps a long-awaited - and deserved- recusal motion will be filed by SC Smith.
Bottom line: NO way the two federal trials will go smoothly and expeditiously, illustrating yet again the only "defense" tRump has against indefensible and felonious conduct is simply massive disruption of proceedings, full stop.
I don’t think he has won any time at all. The first pre-trial hearing isn’t until August 28th. The protective order fight doesn’t really buy him any time.
According to Wednesday's WaPo, tRump's lawyers are asking for an additional 25 days beyond Judge Shutkan's tentative Aug28 pre-trial hearing to fix a date for the usual "we need more time for preparation in such a complex trial", so more defense argumentation to slow things down, if the judge agrees with schedule changes.
Well, "normally", the protective order filing and ruling would have been completed Monday, but Judge Shutkan allowed several additional days for tRump's team to prepare for in-person arguments...granted the initial pre-trial hearing was set for the 28th, but it's the plain fact that "Mr" tRump is clogging the court calendar with his defense motions, and after the judge sorts out the protective order business, surely as night follows day, tRump's team will follow on with more rubbish to buy time, and soon enough that pre-trial hearing date may be set back, as is the tRump plan.
I’m worried about Cannon; it’s clear that she will do all she can to assist defendants, way way beyond her responsibility to make sure the process is fair to both sides. And her inexperience in criminal matters means she doesn’t have the knowledge to handle this case.
Such a tightrope for Smith; if he appeals he opens the door to more delays which is tfg’s defense playbook. I’d he doesn’t, does the case go off the rails. Thankfully Smith is playing chess while tag and his lawyers are struggling with chutes and ladders.
I know, I read an article about it and she’s so brazen, she disclosed it on her financials. Now, she’ll screw around for that piece of trash trump to ‘help him’. She needs to be jailed along with him.
According to this Newsweek article, GMU's "Anton Scalia Law School" picked up the tab two years running for a law colloquium in MT that *Judge* Cannon attended...Leonard Leo has donated to the School, but he doesn't appear on Cannon's financial filing.
The Law School hosted the event, and we don't know how many other attendees were reimbursed for expenses incurred for that week of the Colloquium; usually, only invited speakers at these dos get comped, attendees not so much.
Could the judge simply ask Trump if he wants a gag order? If he says yes, then give it to him. If he says no, then outline the simple words of the restraining order about people who are witnesses or who have been involved with the case and the materials that are presented being put into the public. Also note, that he appears to have already stepped over the line that was designated at his original indictment hearing, and if he is found to do this again, he will be put in jail and his bond will be revoked.
Why should he get second chances. He was told the conditions. He signed off on it. Nobody else would get a second chance. And it isn't like he just made one statement. He did it again and again. I say give him at least a week in jail to think about it. One night wouldn't do squat. He would call it a victory and squawk about the 1st Amendment. Besides, the whole country could use a week off hearing the the orange Ahole.
You clearly have had experience tending recalcitrant ruffians (no matter their age) and have developed words and ways to “have a productive conversation” about boundaries and expectations. Truly truly truly. (Please don’t misunderstand this as my typical snark.) 😊
Indulged child that he is, while still lacking a nurturing upbringing, TFG literally does not know what he is doing is only making his problem worse. I've known five-year-old children that could figure this out.
Stern reminder from the judge of the conditions, pointing out that she is watching him, and the next step is to revoke the bond. He can understand that. If he continues, immediate gag. If he still continues, a night in DC's "finest" roach-and-rat infested "hotel" where he has to basically pee and poop in front of everybody, and listen to the cat-calls of his fellow inmates, most of whom he despises because of the color of their skin.
I hope they embed some tweaked wording or slight alterations or something in the documents they hand over during discovery so they can prove that anything leaked came from tRump. You know he'd leak it through channels and then blame it on someone else.
He will never figure out that his behavior is the cause of his problems. He will keep throwing tantrums until he gets his way. He won't and will wail about the consequences, but he'll never figure out that it's his fault. After 70+ years of conditioning, I don't think that behavior can be modified.
His behavior IS the "strategy", and has been obvious for a while...it's calculated, make no mistake on that score.
Do you really think his behavior is calculated? I'm thinking he's so sick that he can't help himself. And he's so used to getting away with everything he does, it doesn't occur to him that he's making things worse and this time is different.
He will not stop, ever. He will violate every order, every requirement, until the only thing left to do is put him in jail. He’s daring the judge to do that. It’s a dominance thing that domestic abusers like him do.
Yup.... HIGHLY unlikely. I just want to put him away to keep him out of the White House.
I agree with Toby Koch. My hope is the legal system continues to methodically do what they're doing. Huge amount of respect for Jack Smith. This bs needs to end.
Jack Smith has dealt with war criminals, Judge Shutkan has handled Jan6 "shock troops", but neither of them have confronted a defendant for whom court proceedings are treated as a blood sport, and who has spent much of his adult life contesting all matter of civil suits. And he hasn't changed his MO now even in criminal cases, as he seemingly has a bottomless well of funding for his courtroom roguery, and can finance all matter of legal chicanery to keep justice at bay.
Long row to hoe for the SC, no matter how willing a presiding judge is to hasten matters forward.
And that's my concern 😟
Hopefully the judge gets him to do the right thing. But, when he doesn't, the repercussions should help him to realize he is not in charge.
Trump needs a wakeup call. A few hours at the Greybar Hotel should do nicely.
I think ratcheting up to a night in jail would play well with moderates.
At this point I'm pretty sure Trump WANTS to be have his release revoked, if only for a few days of jail time. You have to consider he will blatantly lie about it and frame it as a desperate Biden persecuting him to win the election. "All I did was post that Biden is corrupt and the next thing you know, they throw me in jail!"
You KNOW his base will believe it without question. And unfortunately, the GOP leadership will support the narrative and about 70% of all Republicans will too.
That's the beauty of having him spend only one night in jail. It's much harder to spin a single night this way, but may be enough to scare him straight.
The much bigger fear is that a large share of corrections officers are Trump supporters, and may make his stay far more comfortable than he deserves.
Two words: Jeffrey Epstein.
That would be both morally problematic as well as cause major political problems.
Morally, because nobody deserves to die for their crime - not even Trump (assuming he is guilty, which he hasn't yet found to be).
And politically because all that would do is make him a martyr, and provide the basis for yet more conspiracy theories. Just look at what's already swirling around Epstein's death.
A much better outcome for the nation, albeit one we cannot influence, would be Kenneth Lay style. At Trump's age and health status, he may well die a natural death.
I've been waiting for that since 2016 & I'm still waiting. He seems indestructible.
What about the corrections officers in DC? They might not be Trump supporters.
Unfortunately, I think he has very strong support in the law enforcement and military community no matter where you go. In DC, Jan 6 may have shifted that a bit, but probably not enough.
S. P: Yes, his base will believe what he says and do what he wants. It doesn't matter if he goes to jail. He wants violence and he'll get it from his cult. So what if the base and the Republicans/Trumpians support the narrative? They already do. The threatening, the bullying will never stop. I'm tired of it.
I'm pretty sure both judges and Jack Smith are working very hard to avoid this sort of drama--it does indeed play right into Trump's tiny hand.
I think that your suggestion about the outcome he’s angling for is inevitable; if not this issue, another will be “trumped up.”
Wondering if sanctions imposed on TFG’s temporary lawyer Lauro at the same time and to the same extent as any applied to TFG might influence the situation? Hmmm...
And it would be a major point to request more donations from the base.
Just like was said before, if you don't want to be tried in DC, don't commit crimes in DC, simple!!! Also LOCK HIM UP. It is the only way to shut him up. He can meet with his lawyers there with extra hours allowed to work on his case ... another simple solution!
I don’t find it simple, but it is a solution. We don’t want the fight over his pre-trial detention to turn into the main storyline. That makes everything seem like a battle over free speech, which it isn’t. We need to play this smart.
Jay you’re right, of course. Trump is no ordinary criminal. The judge has her work cut out, for sure. Like the others here, I’m anxious to get him in court and hopefully in jail. But yes, gotta be patient. I’m very confident in Jack Smith and his team. 👍🏻
To quote TPM's David Kurtz:
"Trump will turn every minor procedural skirmish into World War III and every serious matter into armageddon. There’s no real way for a reasonable judge to balance that kind of strategy in a way that doesn’t allow for at least some delays."
I laughed way too hard and outloud in the middle of the office at the "Herr Cheeto". Good one, Jay!
It’s the whole line… “How do you solve a problem like Herr Cheeto”… from someone who loves, writes and produces musicals. I actually sang it out loud, in that lilting way…
Ha! Now I’m singing it! 🤣
Same!
"How do you solve a problem like Herr Cheeto?"
I read that sentence while singing it to the tune from Sound of Music (how do you solve a problem like Maria). I assume that was intended. ;-)
Same 😂 🎶 😂
definitely a flibbertigibbet, a clown 🎶
You guys....☺️. I’m hugging you all!
I did as well
I think we all did lol
Maybe his anger will kill him! All that boiling, and if he is restrained so that he has no outlet for his rage, he might just explode, literally. (I can just see it, although every thought I have of this man-child is so terribly disturbing!)
Hah...I agree completely! All that rage needs an outlet and if Trumpy can't vent online or throw catsup on walls...maybe, just maybe, we can be witness to a trumptantrum resulting in a complete physical blowout. Undoubtedly this makes me a bad person, but I'm rooting for a CVA or an MI...however, TBH, I really don't care; do you?
I’ve been praying for a stroke for the past 6 years!
Thanks Jay. I'll share this on FB. However, it seems to me that the real, long-term solution to Trump is for Americans to turn out in force on Election Day in 2024, reelect Biden with a strong majority (as well as holding the Senate and turning the House), and remove any possibility that Baby Donald Smallhands the Insane is able to regain power and pardon himself, which is clearly what his long-term, long-shot strategy is.
Agreed. This is a political problem as much as it is a legal one.
"Baby Donald Smallhands the Insane"... and coffee spfttts all over the screen.
YES!!! I read somewhere that we cannot depend on Jack Smith (or any super hero) to 'save' us. We must save ourselves and the country through as much hard work as we are able to muster.
We allowed this situation to grow and ripen for many years...now we must deal with the noxious fruit that our former comfort & apathy created. Motivate the Millennials and Gen X's to vote, join grassroot progressive or Dem organizations, volunteer to work at the polls during voting time, offer rides and help for registering new voters, offer rides to the polls in November. Leave no election unvoted... We can do this.
From your lips to gods ears... BTW - “baby Donald Small Hands the Insane”wins the internet today. 😂😂😂
I wish I had faith that that could happen. At the moment it’s hard to see a way forward - to many leaders willing to ignore the law.
You always make me feel better about all this chaos. He’s always calling for violence and it’s exhausting. We must get rid of him and his Maga minions must be put down.
The point is, in DC tRump has "won" an extra courtroom week by filing a lengthly - but probably failing - motion to not only broadcast freely via SM all but a few selected bits of evidence as HE sees fit, but also to bring on board "volunteer attorneys" to share in the discovery. And his lead lawyer also let out that tRump is "demanding" a recusal order for Judge Shutkan, but no decision on that motion has been reached. So, delay-delay-delay...as one motion gets tossed, yet another is filed in its place. Yes, the judge is trying to run a tight ship, but with such an unprecedented defendant as "Mister" tRump, lengthening of routine court practices is unavoidable, which of course IS his defense "strategy".
And the situation in Fort Pierce in the docs case has blown up, with *Judge* Cannon acting as Defendant Nauta's counsel, by suggesting HE file a motion questioning the use of TWO grand juries in sending up indictments...extra two weeks gained by the Defendants there. Then she rejected the government's request to seal the so-called "Garcia" hearing into the attorney, Stanley Woodward, and potential conflict-of-interest regarding multiple-client representation. After a few quiet weeks, *Judge* Cannon is now showing her true colors, and perhaps a long-awaited - and deserved- recusal motion will be filed by SC Smith.
Bottom line: NO way the two federal trials will go smoothly and expeditiously, illustrating yet again the only "defense" tRump has against indefensible and felonious conduct is simply massive disruption of proceedings, full stop.
I don’t think he has won any time at all. The first pre-trial hearing isn’t until August 28th. The protective order fight doesn’t really buy him any time.
According to Wednesday's WaPo, tRump's lawyers are asking for an additional 25 days beyond Judge Shutkan's tentative Aug28 pre-trial hearing to fix a date for the usual "we need more time for preparation in such a complex trial", so more defense argumentation to slow things down, if the judge agrees with schedule changes.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2023/08/08/jan-6-trial-date-trump-deadline/?utm_campaign=wp_todays_headlines&utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&wpisrc=nl_headlines
Well, "normally", the protective order filing and ruling would have been completed Monday, but Judge Shutkan allowed several additional days for tRump's team to prepare for in-person arguments...granted the initial pre-trial hearing was set for the 28th, but it's the plain fact that "Mr" tRump is clogging the court calendar with his defense motions, and after the judge sorts out the protective order business, surely as night follows day, tRump's team will follow on with more rubbish to buy time, and soon enough that pre-trial hearing date may be set back, as is the tRump plan.
I’m worried about Cannon; it’s clear that she will do all she can to assist defendants, way way beyond her responsibility to make sure the process is fair to both sides. And her inexperience in criminal matters means she doesn’t have the knowledge to handle this case.
I’m watching her and that ruling closely to see what Smith does.
Such a tightrope for Smith; if he appeals he opens the door to more delays which is tfg’s defense playbook. I’d he doesn’t, does the case go off the rails. Thankfully Smith is playing chess while tag and his lawyers are struggling with chutes and ladders.
What do you think of her asking Smith to justify the out-of-state GJ?
Load of ignorant hogwash!
She may yet get another major slap-down from the 11th Circuit...she isn't doing their reputation any good at all.
Only on appeal from the prosecutors, and that may be not long in coming.
Leonard Leo paid for Judge Cannon and her family to go on a $1000 a night ‘vacation’ in 2022. She disclosed it. This is how judges behave now???
🤬🤯
I know, I read an article about it and she’s so brazen, she disclosed it on her financials. Now, she’ll screw around for that piece of trash trump to ‘help him’. She needs to be jailed along with him.
🤬😡
According to this Newsweek article, GMU's "Anton Scalia Law School" picked up the tab two years running for a law colloquium in MT that *Judge* Cannon attended...Leonard Leo has donated to the School, but he doesn't appear on Cannon's financial filing.
https://www.newsweek.com/what-aileen-cannon-financial-disclosures-reveal-1817233
Thanks for the article. But is this ethical and legal? We all know Leo is the Federalist Society.
The Law School hosted the event, and we don't know how many other attendees were reimbursed for expenses incurred for that week of the Colloquium; usually, only invited speakers at these dos get comped, attendees not so much.
Sadly this seems the new judicial reality
🤬🤬🤬
Could the judge simply ask Trump if he wants a gag order? If he says yes, then give it to him. If he says no, then outline the simple words of the restraining order about people who are witnesses or who have been involved with the case and the materials that are presented being put into the public. Also note, that he appears to have already stepped over the line that was designated at his original indictment hearing, and if he is found to do this again, he will be put in jail and his bond will be revoked.
Why should he get second chances. He was told the conditions. He signed off on it. Nobody else would get a second chance. And it isn't like he just made one statement. He did it again and again. I say give him at least a week in jail to think about it. One night wouldn't do squat. He would call it a victory and squawk about the 1st Amendment. Besides, the whole country could use a week off hearing the the orange Ahole.
You clearly have had experience tending recalcitrant ruffians (no matter their age) and have developed words and ways to “have a productive conversation” about boundaries and expectations. Truly truly truly. (Please don’t misunderstand this as my typical snark.) 😊
Indulged child that he is, while still lacking a nurturing upbringing, TFG literally does not know what he is doing is only making his problem worse. I've known five-year-old children that could figure this out.
Stern reminder from the judge of the conditions, pointing out that she is watching him, and the next step is to revoke the bond. He can understand that. If he continues, immediate gag. If he still continues, a night in DC's "finest" roach-and-rat infested "hotel" where he has to basically pee and poop in front of everybody, and listen to the cat-calls of his fellow inmates, most of whom he despises because of the color of their skin.
I hope they embed some tweaked wording or slight alterations or something in the documents they hand over during discovery so they can prove that anything leaked came from tRump. You know he'd leak it through channels and then blame it on someone else.
That wouldn’t be permissible, but it’s a cool idea.
I loooove this idea!!!
Love this! Put something hair-brained that he would latch on to and catch his stupid azz
🎶How do you catch a clown and pin him down?🎶